>> don't forget. start the day with ainsley. we'll see you back here tomorrow night. this is a fox news alert. h.h.s. secretary kathleen sebelius has just announced a new date. she has now agreed to also testify before the u.s. senate on november 6th she will be there. that's the date she will appear before the senate finance committee. and tomorrow, of course, she testifies at a house energy and commerce committee hearing. and right now how is it that president obama seems to be the last to know? isn't he president? isn't obama care his program. first it was the rollout flop and now -- >> according to news reports, the obama administration knew for at least three years that millions, millions of americans would not be able to keep their health coverage. >> now, we know this morning

is the president knew these letters were coming. >> the president kept saying, you know, if you like your plan, you can keep your plan. your premiums will be going down. but, in fact, the letter is completing contradictory to that. >> if you like your doctor, you will be able to keep your doctor, period. if you like your healthcare plan, you will be able to keep your healthcare plan. period. first, no matter what you've heard, if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor under the reform proposals that we put forth. if you like your private health insurance plan, you can keep it. >> if you like your plan, you can keep your plan. if you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. i don't want to interfere with people's relationship between them and their doctor. >> as the law states, if you had a plan on the individual market that you wanted to keep, you could keep it, but the law could not order

insurers not to cancel that plan. >> breaking the president's promise that if you like the care you have, you could keep it, hell no. the affordable care act it in its very rules are guaranteeing millions of people will be thrown out off the healthcare they want. >> karl rove joins us. nice to see you, carl. >> good to see you, greta. >> karl, the president is getting a lot of heat for that comment because people are saying he knew people would lose their healthcare plans are. i'm not so sure that he actually knew it that he was that connected to it i don't know if that makes it worse that he was that disconnected from the actual rollout or that he knew and looked the other way. i don't know which is worse. >> that's a good point. though, he had to know. on december 19th of 2009, the congressional budget office sent to congress a letter this was also received at the white house that said between 8 to 9 million americans are going to lose their employer-provided coverage.

they thought that would be offset by 6 million people getting coverage by their employers who previously had not gotten it. says that black and white. march 20th of 2010, just as the bill was getting ready to be passed. page 10 from a similar letter from the congressional budget office joint committee on taxation. they say 8 to 9 million people will lose their employer provided coverage. that will be offset by some number of people, 6 to 7 million people getting coverage previously not gotten. 8 to 9 million people would not be able to keep what they got. april 22nd, the centers for medicaid and medicare services at the department of health and human services says 14 million people, page 7 of their document. these are all people getting the employer provided coverage. we also knew right from the get-go that people in the individual market who bought it themselves, they would not be able to keep their coverage, a large number of them because every one of those policies was going to be subject to a new series of rules and regulations that were going to add to

the cost of those insurance policies. and private estimators suggested that a large number of the individual market would lose their -- would lose their options. so the president knew this. you are right, greta. what's disturbing? if he did know it, how undetached are he and his people? i mean, that west wing is stuffed with a lot of smart people. ant are they what'sy? going on? if he did know, how cynical and deceptive was it for the president to keep saying what he he said which was if you like what you got, you can keep it. >> well, a couple things, all those letters were released to the media. we all get copies of them and none of the media organizations were particularly moved by those. they just ignored it and willing to accept that sound bite that everything is going to be, you know, if you liked your plan you could keep it let me just say, i guess this sort of folds into it too now what we are learning tonight ed henry is reporting that cgi, which is one of the myspace contractors for obama care and that they -- i don't

know which is better that he ignored a report or that he didn't see a report when he got warned. >> yeah. look, i think there are two big questions here. let's take the first one about the speeches. it may be representative of something. inside the white house, every remark made by the president. every prepared speech no matter how important or how routine is reviewed by the top advisors to the president in a process generally overseen by the staff secretary. literally every day i was at the white house i would get these little slips of papers attached to a draft speech some modest remarks about a sports champion coming to the east room. others were major addresses. every member of the president's senior staff had to read these review these, and make comments on them. so, the president's people had to know like the president knew that this was wrong that the president couldn't say if you like what you have got you can

keep it and yet, for years, smart people like bill daley and rahm immanuel and valerie jarrett and david axelrod and david plouffe red these speeches none of them said to the president mr. president your credibility is on the line. >> something is really weird here, karl. i noe i work at fox. some think it's a big fox conspiracy to get the president. we all sort of same situation about the ridiculous thing about the video benghazi that that assume how sparked the activity at the consulate. patently absurd and latest september 25th u.n. at some point don't people at the white house know we have videotape? i mean, like whatever they say we catch. and at some point do they think that we're not going to see this? >> yeah, look, i take away from it that they simply have contempt for the white house press corps and contempt for the intelligence of the american people. their view is if we simply say it enough, if the president goes out there and

assess if you like what you got, you can keep it, that that's going to be enough. if they can go out and say it was that phony video of benghazi and say what does it all matter? we're not going to address that any longer that they can get away with it look, it's corrosive of the president's credibility. but also corrosive of our general trust as americans in the institutions of our government. there is also another problem here, greta. which is if they are as sloppy on this on what they say, how do we know that they are any better on what they do. there is also a policy process inside the white house, and too much of what the president does seems to be haphazard and, you know, sort of thrown together and spur of the moment whether it is foreclosure affairs where he says two years ago it's time for are a assad to go and doesn't do so or the stimulus where he says i'm going to stimulate the economy but let congress write the bill but it ended up being a stupid bill that did not stimulate the economy. >> today i particularly appreciated the woman testifying who is head of cms because she apologized.

i actually can accept, you know, when people make mistakes. it's tough to be president. it's tough to be any of these jobs. they are really rough and if you make a mistake. when you keep telling us and in the face of reality is something different, it does, at least for me, undermine my confidence. you know, don't keep telling me something that just simply is not true and then when you get caught with your pants down at least say you are sorry and explain it >> yeah. look, let's be clear about this. this is not the only outright distortion, deception, untruth being said, told by the president about the affordable care act. he also said our premiums would go down. they have not gone down. he said it would reduce the total amount of healthcare spending in the country, that's not true. he said it would not add a dime to the deficit. instead, sure it does, it borrows half a trillion dollars from the medicare which is going broke and is running out of money and has no money to lend and uses that to fund this thing. he said he would never raise taxes on anybody who made less than $250,000 a year.

yet, the bill is funded by half a trillion dollars in taxes on medical device companies, drug companies, hospitals, healthcare providers and insurance policies all of those costs will be passed on to people who make less than $250,000 a year and more than $250,000 a year and happen to be sick. a lot of sick people, people who need a medical device or drug, a lot of those people make less than $250,000 a year. >> well, what's so disheartening to he me, karl, is you i really want the american people who are sick to get access to medical care. i really do. and to put a bum program up, all it does is sets us back so much further. we really did need to do something about our healthcare system. people are hurting in this country and we needed to fix it but having a bum solution is almost one of the worst things you can do because now it sets us back. >> i tried to sign on to healthcare.gov just before i came and nine minutes after the last hour the system is

down at the moment and we are experiencing technical difficulties and hope to have them fixed in a hurry, they said. you are right. this is a bum program. this is just not a a web site it has a whole bunch of perverse incentives in it disincentives for people to work and disincentives for people to have quality health coverage and disincentives for people to be independent in their lives and making choices. i don't like the government telling me -- i like my current healthcare program. i suspect by 2015 i won't be allowed to have it. etna did allow small businesses like mine to renew my policy before 2014 before the deadline so we don't have to face this disaster until 2015. i'm really worried i'm not going to be able to keep the policies that i and my employees like to have. and that's -- pose supposed to be the system, the solution tour problems is a solution that causes people to lose their coverage? >> i'm going to take the last word on this. i have been pretty lucky. i will work it out. i really do feel there are

so many people across america, middle income or lower income that don't have jobs they really needed a solution. if this one has created so many problems that it's really regrettable. i'm taking the last word on that, karl. thank you. >> better solutions were available. >> thank you. straight ahead, would you buy a car if you never saw it? didn't know the cost or what was even under the hood? well, how about a healthcare plan? if you didn't know the premium prices or the list of doctors, what would you do? our next guest says obama care is forcing him to do just that and he is not happy. that's next. and also this hour house republicans lighting into the medicare chief. one republican so mad he is even pulling out his iphone. why was that? he is going it tell you coming up. you can hash it out with us. what is the one question you would ask h.h.s. secretary sebelius at the hearing tomorrow. tweet or post on facebook right now

nonstop hundreds of thousands of americans getting cancellation letters from healthcare health insurers. nick diaz is one of them. is he here to tell us what happened after he got the letter and started the frustrating obama care process. nice to talk to you, nick. i should add that we found each other on gretawire you posted a comment or wrote me. thank you very much. tell me, what happened, what's your healthcare experience? >> greta, i have got an experience not unlike a lot of other people. i got a letter from my insurance carrier back in

june, actually telling us that our policies were going to be cancelled effective january 1st of 2014. and, you know, really i found it fairly interesting. in the same letter they said they were going to refer us to another insurance company. they had worked out, quote, an arrangement to deal with it unfortunately, because we have some fairly minor preexisting conditions, you know, we applied for individual coverage outside the exchange and have been denied coverage. so now, you know, we are basically stuck and we are at the mercy of the exchange. and i could go on and on about the experience trying to get through that. >> i actually went -- i mean, have you been trying to get on the exchange for a long time. did you find something satisfactory on the exchange? >> well, i never could get on the exchange to get a true price. they give some sample pricing but the information that i was able to get to did not give any actual quotes, deductibles,

co-insurances, out of pocket. any of that kind of information. so, what i did do was i identified some of the carriers that are actually going to offer coverage in our area. so i went directly to the private company's web site and was able to locate policies directly through the company that will comply with the mandate and was able to locate, you know, a number of different possible alternatives that might make sense. >> one that i read about that you found, premiums and out-of-pocket costs for you and your wife will be about $24,000 a year. about comparable to what you have? >> that's a little bit more than what we have got. the premiums that would be under this policy are comparable to what we are paying now but our out-of-pocket is 85, to 84 in a year. even if it were the same money, even if there was no change, i then get the pleasure of having increased

tax burden for funding this thing. >> indeed, well, a lot of people are are having a lot of trouble with this. i know you tried to get on the web site and work that out. nick, thank you. and stay in touch if anything new happens in your search to get the right insurance. thank you. >> thank you, greta. coming up senator john thune is here and he is clobbering the obama administration. what now? he is next. donald trump has advice for the nfl. could the donald's big idea help your team? find out coming up.

>> okay. you want to get out your wings and beer for this one. tonight a hot sauce company is taking heat. it is accused of stinking up the air around the factory. filing a lawsuit. asked the judge to stop

production at the hot sauce factory. the suit calling the odor from the plant a public nuisance. the hot sauce maker denies there is an odor problem. you be the judge, if you lived near that factory would the smell of hot sauce make you mad enough to file suit or cook up extra wings. go to gretawire.com and vote in our poll. also coming up, is the obama administration going to regret saying it's more than just a web site. senator john thune is here

let me remind everybody that the afordable care act is not just a web site. it's much more. >> the affordable care act is much more than a web site. >> this isn't a a web site, it's about healthcare and about affordable plans. >> we know that consumers are having difficulty enrolling by the marketplace web site. it is important to note that the affordable care act, however, is more than just a web site.

>> president obama and his administration insists obama care is more than just a web site. now do some republican lawmakers agree. senator john thune joins us. >> nice to see. >> you i will tell you when they get a phrase going any administration they really work it. you agree with the president on this and the administration. >> unfortunately for the american people, they are right', it is more than just a web site. it's it's a lot of very harmful impacts of this law. and more and more of that is coming to the surface now. we are seeing more evidence. a lot of report not guilty last few days about people being dropped. cbs news reporting that 2 million people have been booted from their healthcare. nbc is reporting that 50 to 75% of the 14 million people who get their insurance in individual market place will be dropped. some are saying that could go as high as 80 o%. i mean, this is the drop coverage, the cancellations, increased premium rates, this really is a disaster. it's much more than a web site problem. >> basic math, this is what i don't understand. you can always sign up for

it before you get sick. develop something sign up the next day. if you don't sign up you pay $95 penalty. if not enough healthy people sign up to pay for the sick people, you know, where do we get the money for this? how does it not sort of collapse within its own -- under the weight of its own problems? >> it could really implodes. if they don't get people subscribed in the exchanges. they don't get people to pay the individual mandate. it's all built on this foundation. >> why would you? if you are young right now and invincible and you know he that if you get sick. god forbid you get sick, you go out and buy it the next day. there is no penalty. there is no preexisting illness penalty. so why would you buy it? if you are young person today and look at the rates. $95 penalty '. >> if you get quality for the penalty. we have something like a 12% or 14% unemployment rate for 18 to 26. where are they even getting the $95? >> they may not come up with

that more importantly as you pointed out, what they simply have to do when they get sick they just go in and get it there is no incentive or discipline in this process that will ensure that money come in the door if these people come into the system. >> i really wanted healthcare for everybody. the thing about it is and this is where we have said all along this is the wrong approach. when you have political command and control of one sixth of the american economy, there are better ways to do. this you can use market based solutions, can you use competition to get rates down for people, so we have got a whole bunch of solutions. we would love to get back and talk about. >> we'll do that senator, thank you, sir. >> thanks, greta. >> it was heated, house republicans grilling the medicare chief about obama care did. she buckle or swing right back? that's coming up. remember the former nfl player whose house was trashed by hundreds of rowdy teens? there is new twist in that story. the latest coming up.

okay, everyone, it's time to hash it out. is donald trump getting into the football business. the mogul sending a message to the nfl about tim tebow. trump tweeting i just don't know why some of these nfl teams with lousy quarterbacks don't give tim tebow a chance? what do they have to lose? tebow was released by the patriots in august. will any team take the donald's advice? stay tuned football fans. this is my kind of holiday national cat day, san francisco, nyc teamed up with cheeseburger to bring you kittens, literally. the car company looking with local animal shelters deliver kittens on demand. $15 snuggle time with a feline and cupcakes to snack

on. all proceeds will be donated to animal shelters in each participating community. too bad d.c. was not on the list. i wish uber could give my cat a ride to fox news. aren't they handsome? and a cell phone saves a man's life in florida. a cell fog phone took a bullet for a clerk. robber firing at clerk during attempted hold up before fleeing. when the clerk gland of chest pain the man complained of pain in the shirt pocket. the clerk wasn't badly hurt. big honor for the late steve jobs. the hollywood reporter tweeting steve jobs early silicone valley home gets historic designation. jobs grew up and built some of the first computers in the home. the ranch style home is currently owned by jobs sister patricia. the commission than masrily approving the historic renovation. any renovations to the home will require additional review. and, it's official, the boys are back in town. entourage creator doug allen ending weeks of speculation about a film version of the

hit show tweeting a photo of himself with the show's main cast with the caption it's a go. love you all. entourage stars jerry ferrera, celebrating the news on twitter on behalf of the four guys i want to thank the entourage guys for the patience the boys are back it always works out. now it's your turn to hash it out with us. use #greta on all your tweets and posts. coming up, should obama care

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representative michele bachmann throwing her support behind the obama care choice act. what's that? representative bachmann joins us. so, tell us, what is this act? >> well, it's freedom, freedom from the individual mandates so that you don't have to pay the penalty because as everyone knows, president obama gave a big break to big businesses. and we're saying everybody needs to have that because now that this is a total failure, we have got to do something about it. and, you know, my home state of minnesota supplied the 60th vote for obama care on

the senate side there would be no obama care if minnesota wouldn't have supplied that 60th vote. so i think really what we need to do is say, for all of you senators and all of you democrat representatives who voted for this bill, you now it's your chance -- it's your time to fix it. so, if my premiums are going up, if my deductibles are going up, if my co-pays are going up, what are are they going to do about it? and i think instead of standing back and saying that's all folks. now they have got to actually do something and they have got to deliver for the american people. >> i mean, you got a chance in the house but zero chance in the senate. would you agree? >> no. i don't agree. >> really? >> i actually think that these democrat senators are going to be so shocked because that is what people in minnesota are saying. what's al franken going to do about the fact that my premium just jacked $2,000 next year or my deductible tripled next year. it's reality. >> see, i -- the young and

invincible are so important to this equation because they don't -- they would pay into it in theory and then they don't take anything out because they are young and healthy. and i have yet to meet someone who i say i will give you $700 you are age 20. do you buy iphone or insurance? >> you buy the iphone, are you kidding me of course they will. >> do you know anybody who would buy insurance over an iphone? >> who in their right mind would buy it? okay well flip a coin. i could pay a $95 penalty or get my iphone? i'm getting my iphone because i don't think they see the reality of paying a penalty anyway if they are ever going to have to do it. >> even if they should get sick three months later they can get insurance then. >> exactly. so the system was never going to work and these geniuses here in washington, d.c. who decided obama care was a great deal, they didn't figure on something called human nature. and that people are going to look out for their own best interest, including 20-year-olds who would much rather go to fort lauderdale over spring break, who would much rather bit iphone who

would rather have internet access and frap pay at starbucks. they are north going to change their lifestyle to satisfy a president with utopian ideals. >> i say this night after night. i really care about the people middle class and people who don't have anything to have a chance at healthcare. >> of course. that's why we would all be better off to put 500 bucks a year in a preexisting plan that's what the "the washington post" said it would cost. i'm a huge fiscal conservative, greta. i would personally write the check for a billion dollars a year to pay for the preexisting conditions of the american people. 5 billion? that isn't even a rounding error in this town. we could take care of that, take that off the table and satisfy the most heart breaking issue for the american people. >> we had to do something -- >> -- and they could have done it. we still could. >> and a we still -- we need to do something for so many americans who don't have access to healthcare. >> because right now under obama care, the sad reality

is for preexisting conditions, that fund is already gone belly up less than 1% of the people with preexisting conditions are getting the money because there is no money in the fund. so there is a big difference between passing a law saying you have got it and having the money to pay for it. >> representative, thank you. >> good to see you. coming up h.h.s. secretary sebelius in the hot seat. what can see say tomorrow to get her out of the rollout

prafer paragraph let's go off the record for a minute. we are approaching the witching hour just to be clear i'm not talking about some hour on halloween that once a year day we may get our trees decorated and toilet papered, by the way, don't tell me you never did something like that because i know most of you. i read your comments on

gretawire. the witching hour i'm talking about here is the other witching hour. it likewise falls on october 31st and specific time 5:00 p.m. that is the date and hour by which our politicians have to make a huge decision. obama care or no obama care for their staff. lawmakers must decide on that date and by that hour how to designate their staffers, either as official or unofficial. staffers designated as unofficial will remain in existing federal system with taxpayers, that means you, paying part of the staff's healthcare costs. of course, that's what the staffers want. they want to keep their existing plan, sound familiar? but if on the other hand o, senators and members of congress designate their staff as official, the staff is then enrolled in the d.c. health exchange. that is obama care. staffers don't want obama care, not at all. obama care will cost each individual staff more money since you, the taxpayers will not be subsidizing their premiums, so as we approach the political witching hour 5 p.m. on october 31st aren't you

curious how leader harry reid and dick durbin what they will do to designate their staff. they are architects of obama care and they have been saying how great it is for you. how about for their staff? are they going to share that goodness with them or keep you on the hook paying part of their staff premiums? what do you think? go to gretawire.com and tell us. and that's my off the record comment tonight. and coming up, h. h. s. secretary sebelius s. secretary kathleen sebelius getting ready to face an angry congress. is there anything she can say to turn obama care around? dana perino is here to talk about that ♪ fare thee well ♪ farewell ♪ mr. gloom be on your way ♪ ♪ though you haven't any money you can still be bright and sunny ♪ ♪ sing polly wolly doodle all the day ♪

♪ hah now it's time to show what you we are watching. we put together the best videos out there tonight. take ache a lot. surfs up in portugal. riding a 100-foot wave likely setting a world record. off the coast of portugal caused by giant storms western europe. while most of them can't

solve a rubiks cube while standing still. wilson did it while standing in sky diving tunnel in record time. he solved the puzzle in three minutes and 16 seconds that does put him in the guinness book of world records. it wasn't the briz who got a kiss at the wedding in thailand it was the bride's made and it was an elephant to kissed her. the 3-year-old elephant taking a liking to the brides maid and wrapping his trunk around the neck. the wedding guest seemed to get a kick out of that one and that's what we're watching tonight. and will we finally get answers? tomorrow is there anything she can do to dig out of the mess. dana perino has the answers for secretary sebelius tomorrow. tell me, what does she do tomorrow? >> i think she has to make sure that she does not get defensive. she is going into what will be a he very difficult hearing. she will have some democrats

who defend her but it's even going to be hard for them. when their constituents are watching. when they see what has happened over the past several weeks to their premiums, to their deductibles and also even if they have tried to get on the web site and it hasn't worked it's hard to defend incompetence. for her standpoint i think she should come with as many facts as she can as many civility as she can muster up. think about hillary clinton's benghazi hearing what's the one sound bite can you remember from that it's when she said what difference does it make? that's the only thing you remember from that hearing. kathleen sebelius has a chance tomorrow to keep it cool even if she has taken a lot of heat. >> you know, i would come armed with the answer to this question. she will get this question tomorrow as we heard many times today how many people have enrolled. they keep saying we are going to tell you november 15th. i would come with the answer tomorrow why they can't tell us now if there is a will he legitimate reason if they can't but don't want to tell us. it's not the most impressive number, it's this number.

even the woman who testified today when massachusetts passed their state healthcare they had really low numbers in the beginning they later grew. that would be an explanation perhaps and beside the fact that the web site a flop. honest. come and tell us don't try to protect this program. just tell us the truth. >> i think that would be a perfect answer for that particular question. also, because they have already said that they had to put jeffrey zoins in to try to fix the web site by november 30th. november 15th from her standpoint is a reasonable date for her to be able to say how many people are going to sign up. >> i think she ought to be able to tell us now. >> well, they could. >> and no, but i think she should be honest. i mean i really find it hard to believe they don't know how many have enrolled by now. i really do. i always say the expression i stick my atm card in dubai half way around the world and takes it out of my bank immediately. they can't tell me how many people enrolled now. >> look at the news that

came out tonight, cgi the contractor to build the web si web site went live said we don't have enough information. we are not able to do. this this site is not ready to go and they went with it anyway. that's a question that she is going to get tomorrow for sure. >> and she should be honest about that you you know, if they had red flags get it out now. in 20/20 hindsight if they should have noticed something that was a big red flag painful drip drip drip is going to be devastating to them. my advice to her tell the truth as best you know it and be totally honest. i'm taking the last word on that, dana. dana, love the five by the way. thank you. >> thank you. >> it's fantastic. dana, thank you. thank you for being with us tonight. see you tomorrow night at our new time you know what that is. it is 7:00 p.m. eastern. tomorrow we are actually going to go to the hearing and go inside the room and watch it to listen to testimony of secretary sebelius to see how she takes the questions because she is probably going to get grilled pretty aggressively by the house tomorrow.

the house is gearing up for her. anyway, you know what's up next. it's bill o'reilly in the o'reilly factor and if you got a few extra minutes, go to gretawire.com. see you, good night. hello. welcome to "red eye." tonight, this. >> alligators declared open season on adorable kittens as part of an internet turf war? and albert eye stein. was he a genius? shocking evidence shows he was no smarter than a fifth grader. and is greek yogurt made from the phones of orphans? none of these stories are on "red eye" tonight. >> let's welcome our guests. i am here with brooke goldstein, founder of the children's right institute and ect dr.er of the law fair -- director of the law fair project. we believe these things are real. and andy levy, hiding behind something. and my repulsive